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How should I respond to right-wingers who say that the Nazis were socialist?

Post by Westyland suppressed by Shamian.

The united-socialist states of america wrote:Yeah but you kinda have to watch what you say in this region

But you only voiced your opinion on China (my is the same as yours btw)...

Thee luka trod

Post by The united-socialist states of america suppressed by Shamian.

The united-socialist states of america

Greatunion of soviet socialist republics wrote:snip

Because Stalin's actions and incompetence is what played right into Capitalist propaganda. He imprisoned and killed his own people, was a horrible strategist, purged his generals for stupid reasons, took over Eastern Europe without letting them return to their Pre WW2 governments leading to issues we still see today. And a friend of mines grandparents were killed in one of his purges.
And I haven't even mentioned the war crimes committed under him which weren't condemned such as when his troops took back Poland and massacred and r@ped innocent Polish civilians and murdered 22,000 Poles in the Katyn massacre which no one talks about nor cares about, people who deny Stalins crimes are no different than Holocaust deniers or Armenian genocide deniers
Stalin is a stain and I hope he is burning in hell where he belongs.
( Pls don't ban me btw this is my opinion )

Pidgeon and Thee luka trod

Rothnia wrote:How should I respond to right-wingers who say that the Nazis were socialist?

Nazis invented the word "privatization," and founded a lot of private enterprises. They were also against all doctrines of Marxism.

Feyrisshire, Pidgeon, and Thee luka trod

Theria han

Radicalania, Sodoran Alesia, Pajonia, Thebrin, and 3 othersPidgeon, The united-socialist states of america, and Thee luka trod

Condemnation proposal: 3 sentence, low effort post trying to demonize an entire region.
Commendation proposal: Semi-wall of text trying to explain why we are angels.

The condemnation proposal is simply the worst to me, but atleast it can give a good laugh the first time you see it.

Pidgeon and Thee luka trod

Romaterra

Well on the plus side I have moved from 15th percentile to top 8% percentile for average income of the poor!

Luftetia and Thee luka trod

Red azolands wrote:Nazis invented the word "privatization," and founded a lot of private enterprises. They were also against all doctrines of Marxism.

They were pretty anti-communist to be sure. I definitely agree that they weren't socialist, but why did they call themselves the "National Socialist Party?"

Thee luka trod

Comrades, here is the Daily News:

Good morning/afternoon/evening!

Give a warm welcome to our newest comrades: Shahinga, Bulopireden, Antifascism, Technocratic switzerland, Westyland, Its a place, Xentive, Captialtopia, Combined syndicates of leninland, Deathpilots, and Bandisk

Here is today's news:

Executive Affairs


  • The Ministry of World Assembly Affairs has posted a voting thread on the current resolution: Link"Commend Roavin". Vote in this thread to determine how our delegate votes. Currently, our delegate has voted FOR the SC resolution.

  • The TCB Card Factory has opened its doors! This program includes regional giveaways, a regional art museum, card requests, and of course, shiny 1% International Artwork badges. TCBs Card Factory is asking for a team of volunteers to help operate card farms to ensure a steady supply of cards are being printed. Think you can help? Sign up today.

  • The Minister of Domestic Affairs has released the Regional Development Program! This is a great way to figure out how to raise specific stats for your nation. If you're not sure how to answer your issues, give this a read. It works as a guide, letting you know how your answers will affect your nation and your stats.

  • Check out the Law Archive! It is an easy way to navigate and keep track of all our laws. This document will be updated as new laws get passed.

  • The Ministry of Domestic Affairs and Ministry of Information are recruiting volunteers. Sign up here: https://tcb.red/forum/forum/15-the-civil-service

Legislative Affairs


General


  • Up for grabs this week from the Card Factory is a lovely Noah's Second Country, kindly donated by our Speaker, Kirk (Sodoran Alesia)!
    To win, and in keeping with Noah's 2 theme, all you have to do is come up with a cool 2 card collection. Any 2 cards that are interestingly linked will do. For example, you could go for Kethania and Westnesia, the 2 longest serving WADs for TCB! Please include a link to your collection, as well as a brief explanation. All entries will be voted upon!
    Closing date for submissions is 6th March, and a 24 hour voting period will follow. Submissions should be sent to Chief of Printing nation or on Discord by tagging @Martyn Sealgaír Kiryu in the Cards Channel!

  • Congrats to the winners of last weeks Saturday Edition puzzles: The union of malaysian socialists and Quartia and Karafuto! Check out this weeks Saturday Edition here.

  • The Regional Development Corps have released their first goal for the region, which is to raise the Average Income of Poor statistic. Read this dispatch for more information on the goal and how to get it done.

  • Want some endorsements? Run the Revolutionary Endorsement Program! It's simple, and doesn't take very much time. Endorse comrades, get endorsed back.

  • Our forums are online, but unfortunately, we have lost a whole year of data. If you applied for citizenship after January of 2020 (Feb-Dec of 2020), make sure to reapply!. You may also have to recreate your account. Apologies for this inconvenience. The government will be working as quickly as possible to re-accept citizenship applications. In order to prevent this from happening again in the future, we will be discussing our options on a forum transfer soon. Stay tuned! (Disclaimer : this only applies if you were registered as a citizen in between February 2020 and December 2020. If you have joined TCB after this time period you do not need to re-apply for citizenship)

This Day in History
By Theria Han


Happy Friday Comrades! I just learned that there are proposals to Commend and Condemn TCB. My personal opinion, the commend proposal is just terrible and rushed. No offense, but the last sentence is literally spelled "Communist block". I even got a telegram that he or she was proud of it. The condemn proposal is at least better, I give it that, but its short and only has one or two reasons why. It's kind of weak to me. If you want to see (if you haven't) here are the links.

Commend The Communist Bloc: page=UN_view_proposal/id=keursa_1614965747

Condemn The Communist Bloc:page=UN_view_proposal/id=kazakhstan_3_1614661479

With that out of the way, here's "This Day in History" for March 5! (Pretty Long)

On this day in 1963, the Hula Hoop, a hip-swiveling toy that became a huge fad across America when it was first marketed by Wham-O in 1958, is patented by the company’s co-founder, Arthur “Spud” Melin. An estimated 25 million Hula Hoops were sold in its first four months of production alone. In 1948, friends Arthur Melin and Richard Knerr founded a company in California to sell a slingshot they created to shoot meat up to falcons they used for hunting. The company’s name, Wham-O, came from the sound the slingshots supposedly made. Wham-O eventually branched out from slingshots, selling boomerangs and other sporting goods. Its first hit toy, a flying plastic disc known as the Frisbee, debuted in 1957. The Frisbee was originally marketed under a different name, the Pluto Platter, in an effort to capitalize on America’s fascination with UFOs. Melina and Knerr were inspired to develop the Hula Hoop after they saw a wooden hoop that Australian children twirled around their waists during gym class. Wham-O began producing a plastic version of the hoop, dubbed “Hula” after the hip-gyrating Hawaiian dance of the same name, and demonstrating it on Southern California playgrounds. Hula Hoop mania took off from there. The enormous popularity of the Hula Hoop was short-lived and within a matter of months, the masses were on to the next big thing. However, the Hula Hoop never faded away completely and still has its fans today. According to Ripley’s Believe It or Not, in April 2004, a performer at the Big Apple Circus in Boston simultaneously spun 100 hoops around her body. Earlier that same year, in January, according to the Guinness World Records, two people in Tokyo, Japan, managed to spin the world’s largest hoop–at 13 feet, 4 inches–around their waists at least three times each. Following the Hula Hoop, Wham-O continued to produce a steady stream of wacky and beloved novelty items, including the Superball, Water Wiggle, Silly String, Slip ‘n’ Slide, and the Hacky Sack. (U.S. Industry)

On this day in 1968, The Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons, commonly known as the Non-Proliferation Treaty or NPT, is an international treaty that was signed, whose objective is to prevent the spread of nuclear weapons and weapons technology, to promote cooperation in the peaceful uses of nuclear energy, and to further the goal of achieving nuclear disarmament and general and complete disarmament. Between 1965 and 1968, the treaty was negotiated by the Eighteen Nation Committee on Disarmament, a United Nations-sponsored organization based in Geneva, Switzerland. Opened for signature in 1968, the treaty entered into force in 1970. As required by the text, after twenty-five years, NPT Parties met in May 1995 and agreed to extend the treaty indefinitely. More countries are parties to the NPT than any other arms limitation and disarmament agreement, a testament to the treaty's significance. As of August 2016, 191 states have become parties to the treaty, though North Korea, which acceded in 1985 but never came into compliance, announced its withdrawal from the NPT in 2003, following the detonation of nuclear devices in violation of core obligations. Four UN member states have never accepted the NPT, three of which possess or are thought to possess nuclear weapons: India, Israel, and Pakistan. In addition, South Sudan, founded in 2011, has not joined. The treaty defines nuclear-weapon states as those that have built and tested a nuclear explosive device before 1 January 1967; these are the United States, Russia, the United Kingdom, France, and China. Four other states are known or believed to possess nuclear weapons: India, Pakistan, and North Korea have openly tested and declared that they possess nuclear weapons, while Israel is deliberately ambiguous regarding its nuclear weapons status.

The NPT is often seen to be based on a central bargain: the NPT non-nuclear-weapon states agree never to acquire nuclear weapons and the NPT nuclear-weapon states in exchange agree to share the benefits of peaceful nuclear technology and to pursue nuclear disarmament aimed at the ultimate elimination of their nuclear arsenals.

The treaty is reviewed every five years in meetings called Review Conferences. Even though the treaty was originally conceived with a limited duration of 25 years, the signing parties decided, by consensus, to unconditionally extend the treaty indefinitely during the Review Conference in New York City on 11 May 1995, in the culmination of U.S. government efforts led by Ambassador Thomas Graham Jr. At the time the NPT was proposed, there were predictions of 25–30 nuclear weapon states within 20 years. Instead, over forty years later, five states are not parties to the NPT, and they include the only four additional states believed to possess nuclear weapons. Several additional measures have been adopted to strengthen the NPT and the broader nuclear nonproliferation regime and make it difficult for states to acquire the capability to produce nuclear weapons, including the export controls of the Nuclear Suppliers Group and the enhanced verification measures of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) Additional Protocol. Critics argue that the NPT cannot stop the proliferation of nuclear weapons or the motivation to acquire them. They express disappointment with the limited progress on nuclear disarmament, where the five authorized nuclear weapons states still have 13,400 warheads in their combined stockpile. Several high-ranking officials within the United Nations have said that they can do little to stop states from using nuclear reactors to produce nuclear weapons. (Cold War)

There are two birthdays. The first, Rosa Luxemburg, who was born on this day in 1871, and was a Polish Marxist philosopher, economist, and revolutionary who was assassinated by the right-wing Freikorps paramilitary alongside her collaborator, Karl Liebknect. In succession, Luxemburg was a member of the Social Democracy of the Kingdom of Poland and Lithuania (SDKPiL), the Social Democratic Party of Germany (SPD), the Independent Social Democratic Party (USPD), and, finally, the Communist Party of Germany (KPD), which she co-founded with Liebknecht. In 1918-19, Luxemburg publicly supported a violent rebellion against the German state, organizing through the KPD and the Spartacist League. She was captured and summarily executed by the Freikorps, government-sponsored paramilitary groups consisting mostly of World War I veterans. Her body was thrown in the Landwehr Canal in Berlin. Due to her pointed criticism of both Leninist and more moderate social democratic schools of socialism, Luxemburg's legacy is a revolutionary school of socialist thought that exists outside of either tradition.

"Without general elections, without freedom of the press, freedom of speech, freedom of assembly, without the free battle of opinions, life in every public institution withers away, becomes a caricature of itself, and bureaucracy rises as the only deciding factor." - Rosa Luxemburg (Birthdays)

The second goes to John Rankin Lawson, born on this day in 1871, and was a union leader of the United Mine Workers of America (UMWA) at the time of the Colorado Coalfield War and the Ludlow Massacre (a violent suppression of a coal worker's strike). Although there were dozens of people were killed during the Ludlow Massacre, Lawson was the only person convicted of murder - for the death of a deputy sheriff who died at Ludlow. He was sentenced to a life of hard labor but was freed on appeal to the Colorado Supreme Court. Lawson also participated in the Cripple Creek Strike of 1903-04. During the strike, Lawson's family home was dynamited in an attack probably executed by mine operators. Although his family survived, his young daughter Fern was thrown from her crib by the blast. (Birthdays)

But also, we remember the passing of Joseph Stalin, who died on this day from a cerebral hemorrhage in 1953. Born to a poor family in Gori in the Russian Empire (now Georgia), as a youth Stalin joined the Marxist Russian Social Democratic Labour Party. He went on to edit the party's newspaper, Pravda, and raised funds for Vladimir Lenin's Bolshevik faction via robberies, kidnappings, and protection rackets. Repeatedly arrested, he underwent several internal exiles. After the Bolsheviks seized power during the October Revolution and created a one-party state under Lenin's newly renamed Communist Party in 1917, Stalin joined its governing Politburo. Serving in the Russian Civil War before overseeing the Soviet Union's establishment in 1922, Stalin assumed leadership over the country following Lenin's 1924 death. Under Stalin, socialism in one country became a central tenet of the party's dogma. Through the Five-Year Plans, the country underwent agricultural collectivization and rapid industrialization, creating a centralized command economy. This led to severe disruptions of food production that contributed to the famine of 1932–33. To eradicate accused "enemies of the working class", Stalin instituted the Great Purge, in which over a million were imprisoned and at least 700,000 executed between 1934 and 1939. By 1937, he had complete personal control over the party and state. Stalin's government promoted Marxism–Leninism abroad through the Communist International and supported European anti-fascist movements during the 1930s, particularly in the Spanish Civil War. In 1939, it signed a non-aggression pact with Nazi Germany, resulting in the Soviet invasion of Poland. Germany ended the pact by invading the Soviet Union in 1941. Despite initial setbacks, the Soviet Red Army repelled the German incursion and captured Berlin in 1945, ending World War II in Europe. The Soviets annexed the Baltic states and helped establish Soviet-aligned governments throughout Central and Eastern Europe, China, and North Korea. The Soviet Union and the United States emerged from the war as global superpowers. The tensions that arose between the Soviet-backed Eastern Bloc and U.S.-backed Western Bloc became known as the Cold War. Stalin led his country through the post-war reconstruction, during which it developed a nuclear weapon in 1949. In these years, the country experienced another major famine and an antisemitic campaign peaking in the doctors' plot.

On March 1, 1953, Stalin's staff found him semi-conscious on the bedroom floor of his Volynskoe dacha. He had suffered a cerebral hemorrhage. He was moved onto a couch and remained there for three days. He was hand-fed using a spoon, given various medicines and injections, and leeches were applied to him. Svetlana and Vasily were called to the dacha in March 2; the latter was drunk and angrily shouted at the doctors, resulting in him being sent home. Stalin died on March 5 1953. According to Svetlana, it had been "a difficult and terrible death". An autopsy revealed that he had died of a cerebral hemorrhage and that he also suffered from severe damage to his cerebral arteries due to atherosclerosis. It is possible that Stalin was murdered. Beria has been suspected of murder, although no firm evidence has ever appeared. Stalin's death was announced the next day. The body was embalmed and then placed on display in Moscow's House of Unions for three days. Crowds were such that a crush killed about 100 people. The funeral involved the body being laid to rest in Lenin's Mausoleum in Red Square on March 9; hundreds of thousands attended. That month featured a surge in arrests for "anti-Soviet agitation" as those celebrating Stalin's death came to police attention. The Chinese government instituted a period of official mourning for Stalin's death.

Widely considered one of the 20th century's most significant figures, Stalin was the subject of a pervasive personality cult within the international Marxist–Leninist movement, which revered him as a champion of the working class and socialism. Since the dissolution of the Soviet Union in 1991, Stalin has retained popularity in Russia as a victorious wartime leader who established the Soviet Union as a major world power. May he rest in peace. (Deaths)

While run by the Ministry of Information, the Daily News does not necessarily reflect the stance of the current administration. Please contact the Minister of Information Pajonia on NationStates or Ant(Pajonia) in the Regional Discord for any corrections, suggestions, questions, comments, or concerns.

This article was authored by Pajonia. "This Day in History" is authored by volunteer of the MoI, Theria han

Read dispatch

Sodoran Alesia, Ganjallia, Thebrin, Theria han, and 2 othersPidgeon, and Thee luka trod

Red azolands wrote:Condemnation proposal: 3 sentence, low effort post trying to demonize an entire region.
Commendation proposal: Semi-wall of text trying to explain why we are angels.

The condemnation proposal is simply the worst to me, but atleast it can give a good laugh the first time you see it.

I just simply can't believe they would speak such slander against our walls. Horrible walls? I spend all day admiring our beautiful walls. It baffles me that someone could find our walls horrible.

Greatunion of soviet socialist republics, Sodoran Alesia, Feyrisshire, Eskostan, and 4 othersThebrin, Theria han, Pidgeon, and Thee luka trod

Rothnia wrote:They were pretty anti-communist to be sure. I definitely agree that they weren't socialist, but why did they call themselves the "National Socialist Party?"

Something to do with socialism being on the rise and Hitler wanting to appeal or deceive the average folk into voting for him, so choosing a workers' ideology's name was a giga-IQ move from him

Greatunion of soviet socialist republics and Pidgeon

Rothnia wrote:They were pretty anti-communist to be sure. I definitely agree that they weren't socialist, but why did they call themselves the "National Socialist Party?"

It apparently "arose out of an attempt to create a nationalist redefinition of socialism, an alternative to both Marxist international socialism and free-market capitalism," according to Wikipedia.

Pidgeon and Thee luka trod

Westyland wrote:I'm new here, but I thought there's freedom of speech in the Communist Bloc...

You're free to say whatever you want as long as it's not racist, homophobic, etc, or sectarian against other strains of leftism. Debating issues is fine, but its important to debate ideas, not to make personal attacks.

Greatunion of soviet socialist republics, Pidgeon, and Thee luka trod

Comrades, remember to vote for a new resolution in WA!

Pidgeon and Thee luka trod

Never seen a World Assembly proposal which better embodied "yikes".
The Internationale will be swift to vote down this ridiculous and discriminatory WA proposal.

Greatunion of soviet socialist republics, Radicalania, Sodoran Alesia, Pajonia, and 3 othersGanjallia, Pidgeon, and Thee luka trod

Carrico wrote:Never seen a World Assembly proposal which better embodied "yikes".
The Internationale will be swift to vote down this ridiculous and discriminatory WA proposal.

Appreciate you, comrade.

Greatunion of soviet socialist republics, Sodoran Alesia, Pidgeon, and Thee luka trod

Carrico wrote:Never seen a World Assembly proposal which better embodied "yikes".
The Internationale will be swift to vote down this ridiculous and discriminatory WA proposal.

Thank you Carrico!

Greatunion of soviet socialist republics, Sodoran Alesia, Pidgeon, and Thee luka trod

Carrico wrote:Never seen a World Assembly proposal which better embodied "yikes".
The Internationale will be swift to vote down this ridiculous and discriminatory WA proposal.

Um... Are you talking about the same resolution? "Protecting Labour Union Rights"?

Thee luka trod

Westyland wrote:Um... Are you talking about the same resolution? "Protecting Labour Union Rights"?

No, there is a proposal in the Security Council to condemn our region.

Pidgeon and Thee luka trod

Post by Greatunion of soviet socialist republics suppressed by Shamian.

Greatunion of soviet socialist republics

The united-socialist states of america wrote:snip...

Red azolands wrote:snip...

Can you give me numbers of those "he killed" so I can debunk you without making presumptions, and state at least some of your claims of incompetence and paranoia etc so I know what I'm dealing with otherwise I'll just assume the black book of communism as your source and other popular lies on the union.

Feyrisshire and Thee luka trod

Greatunion of soviet socialist republics

Rothnia wrote:How should I respond to right-wingers who say that the Nazis were socialist?

You could start by pointing out how socialism is democratic system with extensive workers control and equality among genders, race, ethnicity etc.
You could bring up the free market (which is a capitalist feature) that existed in the nazi economy, with an emphasis on supporting the ruling class, limited scientific advancement, minimal social policies. They also suppressed workers, took away their right to strike didnt give them workplace or any democracy, subjugated themselves to the factory owners, they had a very militaristic government, worked to create an empire, didnt recognize people's rights to autonomy, equality etc. Worked counter to any form of participation of the working masses, didnt have any significant public ownership of the means of production, companies still worked to extract a profit. Their rabid opposition to socialism and any other form of democracy. The only thing Socialist about them was the word in their name and the few social policies they had came from the weimar government not them. Tell those right wingers to read fully the quote from hitler they are using as a basis of this purported socialism, which is (and sorry for quoting him) "... for I too am a Socialist, but a different kind of socialist. All this Socialism you've heard is nothing but Marxism," or something like that I'm not a hitler groupie so i probably misquoted it.

There are so many things that this list could cause a singularity, the best method of approach is to ask for their non-wikipedia definition of Socialism so that you could correct them knowing from where they are basing their claim on, and remember dont get emotional or personally attack them the point of an argument isnt to win it but to persuade them.

Luftetia, Feyrisshire, Pidgeon, and Thee luka trod

Post by Pidgeon suppressed by Shamian.

Greatunion of soviet socialist republics wrote:Snip

Don’t we have a policy against denying genocide? Seriously, while some have inflated the numbers it’s silly to suggest that Stalin’s regime wasn’t responsible for atrocities. Holodomor. Katyn. The doctors plot.

If you want to RP as the Soviets that’s fine, but for those of us who are fighting in the real world for democratic socialism and Marxist principles for the FUTURE, this focus on the past gets more than a little tiresome.

The Soviet Union is gone. Let’s strive to take the good, leave the bad, and strive to achieve something better.

Thee luka trod

Post by Monoghan suppressed by Shamian.

Pidgeon wrote:Don’t we have a policy against denying genocide?

what "genocide" are you accusing the Soviets of committing now?

Greatunion of soviet socialist republics, Saniston, Ganjallia, and Thee luka trod

Ite, you got all the moderators ready to jump on this. Be nice.

Pajonia, Ch1cken, and Thee luka trod

Is it true that Norway or the nordic countries more "socialist" than Venezuela. If so why?

Thee luka trod

«12. . .17,33017,33117,33217,33317,33417,33517,336. . .20,54520,546»

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