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Takiv wrote:I need to get more popcorn

I'm not nearly qualified enough to join in, unfortunately. Never read the Bible all that much.

Same. Never was particularily religious nor did I grow up in a very religious family.

Holy Karenland wrote:

Islam has remained exactly the same for 1500 years and you aren’t nearly as against that. Try going to Iran and see how accommodating they will be to your lifestyle.

Well that's untrue on all counts. Islam hasn't quite gone through the renaissance and enlightenment that Christianity has (for the most part); and Iran is a bad example - Iran is a country when a ultra-conservative fervent mafia are using religious fervour and twisted doctrine to maintain control over a people; whilst exporting their terror and disfigured ideology to wage a clandestine war against it's enemies.

If the so-called Islamic revolution didn't take place in Iran - it would be a much more enlighten version of Islam we'd be seeing today their (as we began to see in the 60s and 70s) - instead of a nation that is the equivalent to a near ironically-perfect rendition of a Handmaiden's Tale in the Middle East.

Great Altera wrote:Well that's untrue on all counts. Islam hasn't quite gone through the renaissance and enlightenment that Christianity has (for the most part); and Iran is a bad example - Iran is a country when a ultra-conservative fervent mafia are using religious fervour and twisted doctrine to maintain control over a people; whilst exporting their terror and disfigured ideology to wage a clandestine war against it's enemies.

If the so-called Islamic revolution didn't take place in Iran - it would be a much more enlighten version of Islam we'd be seeing today their (as we began to see in the 60s and 70s) - instead of a nation that is the equivalent to a near ironically-perfect rendition of a Handmaiden's Tale in the Middle East.

Iran is obviously the more extreme end, but you do have a lot of countries where Islam has developed into a more milder form. Don't know a better term to be honest.

Albania, Bosnia, Kosovo, Turkey (some regions being exceptions) and Azerbaijan come to mind.

Takiv wrote:I need to get more popcorn

I'm not nearly qualified enough to join in, unfortunately. Never read the Bible all that much.

Me neither to be honest; I mainly use the bible to translate stuff in my conlangs (not for Nhoor yet though, as Nhoor's main religion is not christianity, although I'm sure that IC there have been missionaries who translated at least parts of the bible in Nhoor).

I was raised christian however, went to a christian school and (therefore) had christian friends, but then I moved away, got new friends, and faith was henceforward not included in my life anymore and I never missed it. If I ever had faith; tbh I think I had more of a connection with the people and just played along than for saving my soul or whatever. Being homosexual also complicates matters; the confusing fact that some christians advocate inclusion but other ones brand homosexuality as illegal and want us to burn in hell, some of them even not hesitating to help us on the way, makes me generally feel very uncomfortable around people I don't know who bring up their faith without reason. When someone shouts 'God is good' out of the blue in an otherwise non-religious context, I will try to move away from them as fast as I can.

Nhoor wrote:Me neither to be honest; I mainly use the bible to translate stuff in my conlangs (not for Nhoor yet though, as Nhoor's main religion is not christianity, although I'm sure that IC there have been missionaries who translated at least parts of the bible in Nhoor).

I was raised christian however, went to a christian school and (therefore) had christian friends, but then I moved away, got new friends, and faith was henceforward not included in my life anymore and I never missed it. If I ever had faith; tbh I think I had more of a connection with the people and just played along than for saving my soul or whatever. Being homosexual also complicates matters; the confusing fact that some christians advocate inclusion but other ones brand homosexuality as illegal and want us to burn in hell, some of them even not hesitating to help us on the way, makes me generally feel very uncomfortable around people I don't know who bring up their faith without reason. When someone shouts 'God is good' out of the blue in an otherwise non-religious context, I will try to move away from them as fast as I can.

Yeah, the last time I was in a church for a religious service was around a decade ago. I never really understood any of it. Being bi and seeing how some Christians (especially ones in my area) treat LGBT people makes me even less interested

Reann wrote:Damn y'all still going at this?

Still?... For how long they've been talking about that?

(That's Cruc / Rezreks btw, hello again everyone)

Kaishin wrote:Still?... For how long they've been talking about that?

(That's Cruc btw, hello again everyone)

about 5 days

News:

viewtopic.php?ns=1&f=4&t=337003&p=42036093#p42036093

Tagging: Nhoor (mentioned in the title and last paragraph).

Takiv wrote:about 5 days

Ohhh... Welp, I'm bad at discussing things and don't like discourses, so I'll just observe

Kaishin wrote:Ohhh... Welp, I'm bad at discussing things and don't like discourses, so I'll just observe

🍿🍿🍿

all the girls are girling girling

It's that time of the year. The Colaza season is kicking back off! Signups for teams close on the 23rd of October, so be quick with signing up!
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=556876

Reann wrote:Iran is obviously the more extreme end, but you do have a lot of countries where Islam has developed into a more milder form. Don't know a better term to be honest.

Albania, Bosnia, Kosovo, Turkey (some regions being exceptions) and Azerbaijan come to mind.

Lebanon and Syria used to be great examples of nations with modernised multi-cultural and religious tolerance - and both corrupted by religious extremism exported by Iran.

Some rare military news from Nhoor: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=337003&p=42036252#p42036252


News from Nhoor appears in the Ɵracil sɵn Nhōrɵs, 'the Oracle of Nhoor', often fondly called Nhoracle - only in written language however, as 'oracle' and 'nhoracle' are pronounced identically due to the fact that the 'nh' is silent.
Go to the Index | Go back to edition 1208 | 2024 A | This is edition 1208 | 2024 B | The next edition will be published at a later moment


Nhōr wcustēre mey Casānisoch pw Repwydo̦sa̦lana “IsleVision”
Nhoor will participate in the IsleVision Song Contest

SĀRRUC, 30 November 2024 | For the first time, Nhoor will be participating in the IsleVision Song Contest, an annual international grand prix to determine the best song of The Western Isles. A national contest that took place at the start of the month was won by the band Broca with their song Urrun (Nothing), which means that they will defend Nhoor’s honour in Vida Cavilas, in The Republic of Baumes. Last year, Baumes’s entry Meu Amor won the Contest that took place in Visconde de Assumpção in Thromsa, which meant that they were to be this year’s host.

Broca, consisting of Nācirtir Juvey (vocals), Pharus Ƨīmeqh (guitar), Ējod Amher (keyboard, electronics), and U̦mār Pɵssa̦ƨiqh, is relatively new in the Nhoor music scene. It was formed during its members’ time at university, but although they enjoyed local fame in Cinharda since 2019, they were first discovered nation-wide last year with their song Arcalast sɵn Jiremhwnɵs (The Grammar of Friendship), which topped the charts for several weeks in the spring of 2023. They have written some songs in English, but most of their output is written in Nhoor.

The song Urrun (Nothing) or with its complete title Taqws nho cimbrunon e ta̦vay ataypese̦m oca̦r, nhā urrun oso̦nhie̦se̦m wnho nōqwn (I want to give you everything, but I’ve got nothing) is also written in Nhoor and deals with a feeling of not being good enough in the eyes of the person you love, expressed most clearly in the refrain Enc, enc nōq ēnēsenwq rēde tā̦r, vada urrun oso̦nhie̦se̦m wnho nōqwn (Why, why would you love me, ‘cause I’ve got nothing). The song has a simple matter-of-fact character, and Broca has confirmed that they won’t dress up spectacularly and that there won’t be any elaborate décor.

“We know that the IsleVision audience likes a lot of fancy stuff, but it wouldn’t match the character of our song, so there will be no shiny uniforms or trapeze acts or dancing armadillos. We discussed it in the band, and we decided that we will be wearing some clothes though”, Juvey joked during the press conference after their national win.

Experts think that the unfamiliarity of the Nhoor language may be a reason for the audience of The Western Isles not to chose Nhoor’s song. Nhoor’s entry isn’t the only one in a local language: Wangano’s Out of the Dark, performed by LAKO, will have some lyrics in Chinese, and Talvistova will enter with Täytyy Yrittää (Gotta Try), by Jarmo Niminen.


Munusta jan Rāylwch pw Runānaj henna LGBTQ+ pw so̦de req Jōrhosoch pw Ƨa̦nsiloririq hwhoromhahen acamese̦m Rholazdar cu Parlamenticu
Members of Parliament urge Raedlon Affairs Minister to discuss LGBTQ+ rights with Takiv chancellor

SĀRRUC, 20 November 2024 | A majority of members of Nhoor’s parliament has urged So̦na Onnwqh, the Minister for Raedlon Affairs, to discuss Nhoor’s view on LGBTQ+ rights with the Takivaj Chancellor Raznak Nogva after the latter’s silence on the matter in the light of international developments made the news recently. The majority consisted of the representatives of the socialdemocrat party COJ, the environmentalist CRh, the liberaldemocrat SIQ, and the small intellectualist party OJ.

Where a number of nations have adopted or supported the LGBTQ+ rights charter that was issued by The Tsunterlands last month, other nations decided to limit the rights of this minority group, with the Lesvan State turning a pride into a state propaganda march lead by that nation’s leader’s sister. The Takivaj Chancellor seemingly caught in the crossfire between support for LGBTQ+ groups and its desire to do business with the Lesvan State, has not uttered a word on the matter. The parties speaking up in Parliament are of the opinion that Takiv should focus its attention more on the Raedlon Organization of States (ROS) and its fellow member states instead of on a controversial and only partially recognised nation on yonder side of Argus.

Minister Onnwqh has answered Parliament that his colleague Acāver Jā̦, the Minister of Foreign Affairs, already summoned the Takivaj ambassador in September to discuss the Takivaj approach to Lesva. This was however due to the fact that Nhoor does not recognise the Lesvan State as a nation and that Takiv and other ROS nations didn’t take this in account when dealing with the Lesvan State.


Miruchea̦ cu Zolacu hevacuvanese̦m eqi ruhute̦tiswlovoreqi nho treynon
Zola citizens evacuated after train derailment

QENHĪMH, 17 November 2024 | About 400 inhabitants of the town of Zola in northern Jōnsoch pw Ta̦rleqh have been ordered to evacuate the area after a cargo train carrying toxic chemicals derailed, causing two wagons to emit smoke and subsequently catch fire. Professional emergency services have been called in to deal with the materials, although the onset of snow is delaying their arrival.

The train was on route from Sārruc to the north when it derailed during a track change near Zola’s western railway station. Several of the train’s 19 wagons derailed, but the materials in only two of them seem to have been compromised. The train driver was unharmed and managed to get into safety.

Zola, north of the larger town of Qenhīmh, is located between two adjacent sets of railway lines (including a high speed railway line) that connect the north with the south. The western quarter of Zola closest to the tracks and the railway station where the accident happened has been evacuated, while the other residents of the town have been advised to keep their doors and windows closed until further notice. One elderly resident was taken to the hospital with signs of a heart attack possibly related to the upheaval.


Zaschey ōlsīƨechā rholasoch pw rhwsa cu RRRh
Corkair sixth member state of ROS

ALBANY CITY (Belantica), 6 November 2024 | The Raedlon Organization of States has now six member states. During last week’s annual summit in Belantica, The Republican Union of Corkair was formally admitted as a Candidate Member State for the duration of six months and with today’s signature by the president, this step has become official.

“We welcome Corkair to the club”, Minister of Foreign Affairs Acāver Jā̦ commented. “Although ROS remains a young organisation that needs to find its way in international politics and in relation to its member states, I think Corkair’s membership will contribute greatly to the region’s stability and the government is looking forward to working with them.”

Founded in 1956 by Catholic, Socialist revolutionaries, Corkair in its present form is a relatively young nation. Recently the nation has become more prominent in the international politics of the Western Isles and its president Mr Murphy Cormac toured the member states of ROS in September to make sure the then current member states Belantica, Costavozka, Solaryia, Takiv, and Nhoor were willing to accept Corkair as a member state. With Corkair’s oil and natural gas reserves now being in closer reach of ROS nations however, economists ask themselves why Corkair’s accession has taken so long.


Ƨuntirte pw ƨa̦rtir jan LGBTQ+ pw so̦dej egemarcalōbane sw̦nh COJ, CRh s VM
COJ, CRh, and VM to sign Tsunter LGBTQ+ rights charter

SĀRRUC, 14 October 2024 | A parliamentary majority of the socialdemocrat Workers’ Party of the Dominion (COJ), the environmentalist Nature Party (CRh), and the centre-right Citizens’ Initiative (VM) indicated on Monday that they will sign the non-binding Charter on the Protection of Rights of LGBT People that was issued in The Tsunterlands in the wake of crackdowns on LGBTQ+ people and institutions in Holy Karenland and the Lesvan State in recent weeks.

“If it weren’t clear already, Nhoor respects and supports the LGBTQ+ community and will continue to do so in the future”, VM leader Nobus Cemhijy stated. “Any excuse to limit the personal freedom of individual citizens is a wrong one and deserves our anger!”, CRh leader Geda̦ronhī Īƨy commented.

The signing is to be interpreted in a symbolic manner, as it is incompatible with Nhoor legislation on personal freedoms, which comes forth from Duvactist tradition and can generally be interpreted as more progressive than many foreign laws. It is for this reason that several other parties in Parliament have indicated not to be willing to sign the Charter, which they consider ‘alien’ to Nhoor’s customs.

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs in the meantime, in line with other nations including Takiv and neighbouring Belantica, has issued a travel warning for all Nhoor to reconsider travelling to Holy Karenland and advises any Nhoor citizen who may currently be in that country to leave it immediately. Nhoor currently has no top level diplomatic relations with Holy Karenland. Nhoor’s travel warning for the Lesvan State is already at the highest possible level, due to the fact that Nhoor does not recognise that country.


Wcēnhire nho arhadragoch pw erodromon van Candavan unsarune sw̦nh Cōrwnwsw̦n
Government approves construction of military airfield near Canda

SĀRRUC/CANDA, 13 October 2024 | Defence Minister Armhad Cellichen announced this morning that the government has approved the construction of a new military airfield near the town of Canda in Orleqh province. In the popular television breakfast programme Cirvasan Ataypese̦m Tā̦r? (‘Do You Want A Croissant?’) he said that the base will support the operations of transport and fighter aircraft and will become the largest such base on Nhoor territory.

The new airbase will be located in the centre of Nhoor, unlike its seven existing counterparts in Centoros, Chwrdunis, Heydandē̦rrelte, Mhaler, Nosy, Orīn, and Tortoly that can be found closer to Nhoor’s external borders. The Canda base can therefore be seen as the future ‘spider’ in a web of air defence, the Minister explained. The costs for the project are estimated at Ꝙ15 billion (IAD 3.45 billion); the project is scheduled to start in 2025 and finish by 2032.

One of the reasons of the construction is to keep Nhoor’s defence forces in line with its partners at the Raedlon Organization of States (ROS). Canda, located at lake Targwna in the very centre of Nhoor, connects the southeast, the west, and the north of Raedlon.

The construction plans also mean that Nhoor is in the market to expand its fleet of aircraft. The Minister said that negotiations with foreign suppliers are ongoing but didn’t want to go into details about it. The new base will host to two newly to be created fighter squadrons, one transport and reconnaissance squadron, and one air training squadron, while an existing squadron currently located on another airbase may also move to Canda.


LGBTQ+ pw rasytīmhana sas so̦ramhome so̦rhi gurch pw cwrdasw̦rh mey Ramo pw Cariney
Further protests by LGBTQ+ organisations against draconian laws Holy Karenland

SĀRRUC, 11 October 2024 | The LGBTQ+ community took to the streets again today, this time to protest recent draconian laws adopted in Holy Karenland against gender variety and expressions of a sexual orientation that is not heterosexual. The matter was even addressed by members of Parliament, who called upon the Ministry of Foreign Affairs to downgrade relations and travel advice with the South Mesder Nation if the laws are not dropped.

“It is beyond our comprehension how any government could turn against the personal freedom of its own citizens like this”, Arcod Nhestarāzy, leader of the socialdemocrat party COJ, commented, calling upon the Karenthian government and parliament to reconsider.

In practice, the Nhoor LGBTQ+ community as an action group advocating tolerance towards the LGBTQ+ community has little to do in Nhoor itself: due to Nhoor Duvactist customs that allow relationships and marriages of more than two people (the Prime Minister herself has two husbands), homo- and bisexuality do not raise any eyebrows, although multi-member relationships composed of only men or only women are not that common.


LGBTQ+ pw rasytīmhana so̦ramhome eqi varnipwmelireqi mey Lesimhanhoch pw Chorocey
Protests by LGBTQ+ organisations after crackdown in Lesvan State

SĀRRUC, 28 September 2024 | Members of the LGBTQ+ community in Nhoor have protested today against a recent crackdown against the LGBTQ+ community in the Lesvan State. The dictatorial regime of the Lesvan State lead by Marshal Iuna Scadi had several people arrested after a night club was claimed to be a ‘front for a counter-revolutionary operation’. The protests in Sārruc and other cities in Nhoor were conducted in a mostly calm fashion; in Silīmh, one person was arrested after trying to engage in indecent behaviour with a police officer.


Dīplomasīnhoch pw suhemhire req artin pw rhwsariq hōlwrusyteme sw̦nh Nhōrwsw̦n
Nhoor intensifies diplomatic relations with a number of countries

SĀRRUC, 27 September 2024 | The Dominion of Nhoor has engaged in more intensive diplomatic relations with a small number of countries in The Western Isles, a spokesperson of the Diplomatic Service of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs has confirmed. It concerns nations which are either relatively close to Nhoor or to Raedlon, or which are members of the same international organisations as Nhoor. For this purpose, ambassadors will be exchanged with The Republican Union of Corkair, The Germanic Kingdom of Kaskalma, The Forumnial Kingdom of Kravato, The Occidental Commonwealth of Thythe, and The Second Commonwealth of Yursea as of October. Discussions with three more nations are underway.


So̦ramhore so̦rhi wrunwchā Lamharrwch pw rholaswnasw̦rh cu RRRh eqi gwrhosiqi mey Zaschee̦y
Protests against potential Arzanan ROS membership after murders in Corkair

NHESTARRUC, 22 September 2024 | Small crowds gathered in the northern cities of Nhestarruc and Lod today to protest against northern neighbour Arzana applying for a ROS membership. The news that 17 people died in the Corkairi town of Thoirbá yesterday as a result of a gunfight between smugglers and local authorities caused some unrest in the five provinces closest to Arzana; the criminal cartels operating in that country are most active in the south, close to the border with Nhoor, and many locals fear that crime will escalate if border controls are eased following an Arzanan membership of ROS.

Public Security Minister Gwzorī Tī̦stely in a comment said that she understands the concerns of the people. “The government shares the same concerns and we have impressed on the Arzanan President Correa that more needs to be done to limit a spread of Arzanan criminal activities to its neighbours if it wants to become a member of ROS.”

Earlier this month, Arzanan President Correa visited Nhoor as a charm offensive to discuss exactly this, but the Minister thinks that it may take years before criminality in Arzana is curbed to a sufficient level to allow Arzana to join ROS. “Recent events in Corkair prove that they are not there yet”, she said.

Corkair is currently an applicant nation of ROS; it is expected that the member states will discuss the application on their next summit in Belantica in October.


Tōƨɵ gil suhemhiregil pē vaqcīntanalƨē̦ req Lesimhanhoch pw Chorociriq nw̦vansanhe Jā̦dar Munustadar
Minister Jā̦ nuances his response to neighbours’ dealings with the Lesvan State

SĀRRUC, 8 September 2024 | On Sunday, Minister of Foreign Affairs Acāver Jā̦ has given further comments on his decision to summon the ambassadors of Solaryia, Takiv, and Graedon two days ago regarding their decision to enhance relations with the so called Lesvan State, as the Treaty of Sārruc clearly puts those nations in the right: Articles 38 to 40 of the Treaty state that

  • Article 38 : Each Member State, Associate Member State, and Observer has the right to develop its cultural, political and economic life freely and naturally. In this free development, the Member State and Associate Member State shall respect the rights of the individual and the principles of universal morality.

  • Article 39 : No Member State, Associate Member State, or Observer or group thereof has the right to intervene, directly or indirectly, for any reason whatever, in the internal or external affairs of any other Member State, Associate Member State, or Observer. The foregoing principle prohibits not only armed force but also any other form of interference or attempted threat against the personality of the Member State, Associate Member State, or Observer or against their political, economic and cultural elements.

  • Article 40 : No Member State, Associate Member State, or Observer may use or encourage the use of coercive measures of an economic or political character in order to force the sovereign will of another Member State, Associate Member State, or Observer and obtain from it advantages of any kind.

“Of course fellow members of the Raedlon Organization of States, and especially Graedon, since it is not a member state yet, have the right to conduct their own foreign policies”, the Minister explained. “As members or prospective members of ROS however, I would have expected that governments at least consult with their fellow member states before unilaterally engaging in relations with a nation the international status of which is controversial.

“As I explained on Friday already, the status of nationals of partially recognised countries within ROS will be dubious as they have the right to visit some countries but are considered illegal immigrants in others. Unless full border controls are reinstated however, it will be difficult to control the passage of these visitors from one ROS member to another. In this context we will need to discuss the creation of a common visa policy for ROS. The issue also touches trade: if products from the alleged Lesvan State enter ROS through Takiv or Solaryia, they may easily end up on the Nhoor market, where they are illegal for purchase and will probably end up on the black market.

“To summarise: the Treaty of Sārruc is there, but I would ask the member states to interpret it not just to their own advantage but to take the fellow member states in consideration. It is this message that I conveyed to the respective ambassadors on Friday.”

Some members of parliament, particularly members of the conservative CCJ, already commented on social media that the government should increase border controls with Solaryia and Belantica again. Similar sounds also emerged from the extra-parliamentary Throngist Party of Nhoor (SCNh) that doesn’t seem very keen on the prospect of dealing with an increased presence of State-Lesvans on Raedlon and in Nhoor in particular.


Behen nho Cadra Lāsten sō̦t Ōcōrwnhaā̦sa̦ pw Mwrasy obosyta̦e̦ im beriƨwcich sw̦nh Parlamentwsw̦n
Parliament to agree to appoint Queen Kadra as Queen-Regent retroactively

SĀRRUC, 7 September 2024 | A majority in Parliament will likely vote on Monday to name Queen Kadra as Queen-Regent retroactively from 1978 to 2000, it has emerged. Queen Kadra’s communications office has replied that the 82-year old member of the Royal Family will be very honoured if this will come to pass.

King Armhad V, who officially ruled from 1971 to his death in 2017, was admitted to a mental institution in 1978, where he spent the remainder of his life. While he had no further close relatives apart from Queen Kadra, who was the Queen-Consort of Armhad V’s cousin King Urhod V during his short reign from 1967 to 1971, Queen Kadra assumed the leading role of the Royal Family as its most senior member and represented the Family and Nhoor on several occasions, however without ever being officially named Queen-Regent. After Armhad V’s dead, two successive Chairpeople of Parliament became Acting Heads of State, until Elerha Maximus of Havalland, a very distant relative of Armhad V’s, was accepted as the new King in 2020.

“The fact that the Queen has never been named Queen-Regent, while in practice very much acting as such, is an omission that we now hope to rectify”, MP for the liberal party LC Brēd Oƨɵmar, who filed the bill, explained. “As for the period between King Armhad V’s death in 2017 and the accession to the throne of King Elerha in 2020, we intend to name Queen Kadra Queen-Regent without annulling the Acting Headships of State of Their Relevancies Ōphɵd Carōmhīqh and Leymhī Arcarany-Ƨach. In practice, Queen Kadra was already at an advanced age and had already reduced her official duties by then; her appointment as Queen-Regent for that period will therefore be mostly symbolic.”

Mr Oƨɵmar’s bill is supported by a majority of at least 117 of 199 seats, as the liberaldemocrats (SIQ, 41 seats), Citizens’ Initiative (VM, 38), conservative agrarians (CCJ, 24), and liberals (LC, 14) have announced to vote in favour. The Nature Party (CRh, 11 seats), and the Future of the Dominion (OJ, 3) will vote against, while the socialdemocrats (COJ, 68) have announced that they will let their members decide for themselves.


Lamharrwch pw bevadunhast umey Nhōrum ōnhunswcāvame E̦qhdar pwr Munusta
Prime Minister welcomes Arzanan guests to Nhoor

SĀRRUC, 7 September 2024 | Prime Minister Orumha Cany-Jwchmiqen has welcomed president Bernardino Correa and several ministers of Arzana to The Dominion of Nhoor in what is the first stop of their recently announced official tour of Raedlon to create goodwill among the members of the Raedlon Organization of States (ROS) regarding a potential Arzanan membership request of the organisation.

While the Arzanan intentions of joining ROS have been outspoken in the last couple of weeks, interest to become a member of ROS is also rumoured to circulate among the government of The Republican Union of Corkair, although official announcements have not been made in that matter. It is however no public secret that the government of Nhoor is increasingly unsatisfied with the way things are going – or rather not going – within ROS, the recent criticism of Minister of Foreign Affairs Acāver Jā̦ on fellow member states regarding their decision to engage in relations with the Lesvan State being a prime example of this. It is possible that the government will want to delay the acceptance of new ROS members until existing issues within ROS have been solved.

And the fact that Arzana had felt it necessary to engage in this tour to convince the ROS members of accepting it as a future member state, is not for nothing either: criminal cartels are very powerful in Arzana and pose a threat to the country’s rule of law. Especially in the south, near the border with Nhoor, murders by criminal gangs are common and the government of Nhoor fears that the Arzanan mayhem may leak into Nhoor if Arzana is added to the free movement scheme between ROS member states.

During the three day visit, which started in Nhoor’s capital Sārruc in the south, the Prime Minister and her guests will on Monday take the high speed train to Nhestarruc in the north, from where they will move on to the town of Nesyta̦rwch on Nhoor’s side of the border with Arzana for a meeting with Arzanan minority organisations and a discussion about border protection and general security in Nhoor that could be jeopardised should Arzana’s cartels get access to the ROS market.

Back in Sārruc, a meeting with King Elerha Maximus is also part of the official programme.


Solarhinā Jōrhōchā Grādɵnwch pw barhen gillwrdache jondi qhorhedemandi gil Lesimhanhoch pw Chorocille
Solaryian, Takivaj, and Graedonic ambassadors summoned for approach to Lesvan State

SĀRRUC, 6 September 2024 | Minister of Foreign Affairs Acāver Jā̦ has summoned the ambassadors of Solaryia, Takiv, and Graedon to ask them for an explanation of their recent engagement in relations with the so called Lesvan State. Several self-proclaimed officials of that entity, which is unrecognised by Nhoor, paid visits to two of the aforementioned countries on Raedlon today, Graedon and Solaryia, while Chancellor Nogva of Takiv recently advocated for the opening of relations with occupied Lesva.

Takiv and Solaryia are fellow member states of the Raedlon Organization of States (ROS), one of them even bordering Nhoor itself. Nhoor recognises the Republic of Lesva instead, which de facto only controls the island of Cane Islo, off the coast of continental Lesva. While Graedon is not a member of ROS, Nhoor has good relations with that nation, which it sees as a potential member state of ROS.

“It is disappointing to see that two fellow members of ROS are maintaining active relations with an entity that has not been recognised by the entirety of ROS’s member states”, Jā̦ commented. “This is yet another example of ROS failing to establish a common foreign policy. Suppose that citizens of this alleged nation enter ROS on a visum for Takiv or Solaryia; what will these people do when they have to travel through Nhoor? Their passports aren’t recognised as valid by our police or customs so in practice that will mean that these so called State-Lesvans can be arrested here as illegal aliens.”

It is expected that the subject will become a hot item on the agenda of the upcoming regular annual summit of ROS that will take place in Belantica in October.


Gamerha nho prusōboch pw berhon sɵn craytisin li Cemhirai̦li culstoche gil Cōrwnille
Government asked to finance Keverai’s disaster recovery plan

SĀRRUC, 2 September 2024 | The Nhoor-Keveraite Association NhCC, a non-governmental organisation that supports Keveraite expats and immigrants in Nhoor as well as bilateral relations between the two countries in general, has asked the Nhoor government and Nhoor insurance companies to fund Keverai’s disaster recovery, for the sake of the continuation of the historical relation between Keverai and Nhoor, the Ministry of Emergency and Disaster Management has confirmed. The call came as financial institutions from Ainslie refused to renew Keverai’s Cyclone Bond, citing the growing likeliness of cyclones and other natural disasters in the future due to climate change.

“Nhoor has had a special relationship with Keverai since the Imperial War, when Nhoor soldiers helped liberate Keverai”, Minister Gwzorī Tennwqh-Tānhar explained. “Back then, Nhoor already sent financial support to the small Argusian nation for reconstruction purposes. The NhCC asks our country to step in once again; they argue that although there is indeed an increased risk of cyclones, the Bond has been in place for ten years, during which time a payout was never needed. I will of course have to discuss this with the rest of the government and any interested insurance companies.”

Initial responses to the NhCC’s request have been mixed, with many experts citing a potentially great financial risk if a cyclone were to hit Keverai hard, and recommending spreading the risk over several insurance companies in and outside Nhoor, potentially making this a ROS project.


So̦ramhore so̦rhi Lāstesw̦rh qese sw̦nh wrunwchwnwsw̦n pē Velsw̦ch pw rholaswnē cu Jōnsoch pw Jā̦cwstirecu
Possibility of Wellsian Eastern Tripartite membership incites protests against Queen

SĀRRUC, 17 August 2024 | The Sārruc Capital Police have had to remove a few dozens of protesters in front of the Sanhirhōty Palace in the city centre several times this morning. The protests were directed at Queen Calavī Victoria, the Wellsian wife of King Elerha Maximus, following the news that Wellsia is in the process of requesting membership of the notorious Eastern Tripartite, a small international organisation whose member states, currently Balnik and the Lesvan State, are generally considered to be dictatorships.

The protests weren’t well coordinated, which explains the fact that different groups ended up in front of the Sanhirhōty Palace at different times. “We are talking about various pro-democracy and human rights organisations who took the initiative to organise spontaneous protest manifestations in front of the Palace,” a police spokesman explained. “None of the organisations had requested a demonstration permit so the police urged them to vacate the street. After discussion with the city council, it was decided that they could protest on one of the central squares. We also dispatched a detail to check the Prada li Gālali, where the Wellsian embassy is located, but no protests were taking place there.”

The Sanhirhōty Palace is the official working residence of the King and members of the Royal Family with official duties. As it was a Saturday, the Royal couple was not in Sārruc but in their main living residence, the Amhordēqh Castle outside the city of Chur. “The protesters could have known that, since the Royal Standard wasn’t flying over Sanhirhōty Palace”, the police spokesman clarified. “No demonstrations seem to have taken place in Chur either, but you will have to ask my colleagues there for more details.”

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs didn’t want to comment on the matter. Minister of Royal and Religious Affairs Tonhae̦ro Arcarany however said that despite being the daughter of King Himilco XII of Wellsia, Queen Calavī’s priorities concern the Dominion of Nhoor, and that her position is not politically related to any political action or opinion of the Wellsian King or the Wellsian government.


E̦ch pw Nhāsɵlteƨy li Sārrucili nhargāā̦rhe orh scandalero iscom twtusoch pw drochim
Sārruc’s First Councillor sacked amid domestic violence scandal

SĀRRUC, 6 August 2024 | Utired Rānharsw̦n, First Councillor of the Province of Sārruc, has been dismissed as First Councillor and as a member of the Sārruc Provincial Council altogether after his husband Ƨwqws Prōsy and his wife Jije̦no Abresuqh and their two children left their main residence in the capital amid a domestic violence scandal. Shortly after his dismissal became public, the local police issued a warrant to arrest Rānharsw̦n for attempted murder, but so far he has not yet been apprehended. The national Police Force of Nhoor has started a manhunt.

The first attention to the case was given two weeks ago, when a neighbour called the police after he heard Mrs Abresuqh screaming in the garden and an ambulance came by later to transport Mr Prōsy to the hospital. Mrs Abresuqh had confirmed to the press that her husband Rānharsw̦n in fact often hit her other husband; the evening that the police was called, he had hit Prōsy several times with a bronze statue. Prōsy left the hospital a couple of days afterwards; he and Mrs Abresuqh have stayed away from the press.

While he was First Councillor, it was difficult to file a lawsuit against Rānharsw̦n, but the members of the Provincial Council came back from summer recess for an emergency meeting today to end his Council membership; Councillor of Budget Ms Pherhī Īlīmhar was appointed First Councillor shortly afterwards. The Provincial Parliament in the meantime was intending to issue a binding advice to end Rānharsw̦n’s Council membership as well, but with several members still on holiday, it was a matter of a couple of days more before the quorum could be reached.

Bosw̦ced Cōrs, the Minister of Regional and Local governments, declared himself shocked by the events. “Citizens who are serving in public office enjoy a certain immunity against prosecution”, he explained. “Currently only murder and proven embezzlement allow immediate arrest. It is very unfortunate when a third party suffers because of the crimes of officials without the police being able to do anything against it.”

Utired Rānharsw̦n had been First Councillor of Sārruc since 2014. Until recently, he had enjoyed a high popularity.


Rutu̦līhast pw rumɵveƨōb ƨocache sw̦nh secw̦rītīsw̦n, rws cen uqaranaca untwtus cemenhe aqqhar
Police raiding warehouse for weapons make unexpected discovery

PANNIRTE, 27 July 2024 | A police razzia in an industrial area outside the town of Pannirte in the province of Heyna in northeastern Nhoor that was tipped off by the national Police Force about the presence of illegal weapons and other explosives, made an unexpected – and indeed rather weird! – discovery. Apart from an arsenal that could overthrow a minor government, they found boxes full of miniature plastic action figures – of Rostyslav Andrij, the leader of Yektov!

“The resemblance with the premier of Yektov is striking”, the Pannirte police commissioner Qebed Mensy explained; “I think that some of the wax museums in the Western Islands may contact the designer of these action figures to get some pointers on his appearance. Apart from that, the casing mentions that’s him so anyone still in doubt won’t be left in the dark for long. The main question here is of course ‘Why???’”

Pannirte’s police were tipped by the national Police Force about arms being smuggled into Nhoor by sea from the east. The combined national and Pannirte’s forces made efficient work of catching and neutralising the arms. Only the four guards who were present at the time were arrested. “That is disappointing, for they most likely know nothing about the greater operation and its leaders”, Mensy elaborated.

The weapons and the action figures have been seized by the Ministry of Domestic Affairs (under which falls the national Police Force). Although there are clear instructions as to what should be done with the weapons, a spokesperson of the ministry said that it wasn’t obvious what had to be done with the action figures.

“Nhoor legislation makes the unauthorised distribution of someone’s image illegal, so the Ministry will first have to find out if these action figures were made by a legal firm”, a spokesperson said. “If not, and/or if the premier of Yektov, Mr Andrij, has objections against his image being distributed like this, we are under legal obligation to destroy all action figures. If the production company is legal and if Mr Andrij has no objections, the Ministry may sell the action figures – but probably not within Nhoor.”


Armhad Cellichen bergeme cō phalis pw Munustamhanaph eqi cābinetoch pw valwsireqi
Armhad Cellichen back at key Ministry following Cabinet reshuffle

SĀRRUC, 5 July 2024 | In the government reshuffle that took place today, Minister of Parliamentary Affairs Armhad Cellichen was appointed Minister of Defence, a move that sees the former First Minister back on a key position in government. An additional piece of musical chairs concerned the three Ministers of Health, Education, and Emergency and Disaster Management, who exchanged places, and the appointment of Pwqad Te̦qhīseqh as the new Minister of Parliamentary Affairs. After former Defence Minister col. Pharus Parhecuch’s surprise announcement earlier this week that he would leave the government, Prime Minister Orumha Cany took the opportunity to replace him and implement these additional changes.

Armhad Cellichen was First Minister (as the term for Prime Minister E̦ch pw Munusta was translated in English back then) briefly in 2019. Parliament forced him to relinquish the post following the scandal involving a former Defence Minister handing information to a criminal organisation, despite the fact that that happened when his predecessor Sanhad Bōra̦ was First Minister.

Cellichen’s appointment to one of the heavier portfolios in government got only few bad responses from Parliament. Previous attempts by the government to ‘get him back’ were thwarted by the former Parliament, but Cellichen founded his own party since, the Vastona jan Miruchea̦j (VM, or Citizens’ Initiative), which has been the third largest in Parliament since the 2022 elections. In January 2023, Cellichen already became half-part of the government again as the newly created Minister of Parliamentary Affairs; now he is back in government completely, and has therefore vacated his parliamentary seat and stepped down as leader of the VM.

Read dispatch

Nobody is tug

Solaryia wrote:
A bold statement, given that if you were to read one line further in Leviticus, than you would find the Bible calling for those who did that act to be put to death. Why would you reject one half of the verse and not the other? Did you not state earlier that “it’s all or nothing?”

However, I do admit that Christ’s fulfillment of the Old Testament law nullifies a majority of punishments these Old Testament rules. In addition I acknowledge that Acts states “It is my judgment, therefore, that we ought to stop troubling the Gentiles who turn to God, but tell them by letter to avoid pollution from idols, unlawful marriage, the meat of strangled animals, and blood.”

However, there are a lot of issues with taking this at face value. The first is pragmatic, in that if you hold such issue with homosexuality, than you should also be just as opposed to premarital intercourse, self intercourse, divorce, and the consumption of certain types of sausages and puddings. This leads into my second issue with taking the verse alone at its word, in that it was created and applied for a cultural context vastly different than the modern world. Just as the consumption of certain types of foods based in blood has long been acceptable and understood that its context came from Jewish tradition and antiquated moral and not divine law and were therefore mostly done away with, provisions regarding the sinfulness of LGBT matters have been slowly becoming accepted among churches in the modern world (note: recent allowances on the blessings of LGBT civil marriages and the reconfirmation that all in the queer community are to be treated with respect and compassion). Personally I don’t believe that this is a sign of church degradation, but rather the revealing of a greater understanding of the Bible and God’s law as Western civilization continues to advance.

Yeah, with your third paragraph, I am opposed to all the things you said except for the consumption of puddings and sausages part. Look at the book of Timothy. The churches who preach that eating meat is against the word of god is denounced by Paul, who legit saw the resurrected Jesus himself. And actually, the bible doesn’t HAVE and expiration date. What Jesus said was a sin is very much still a sin. The next and last biblical event as told by Jesus in the Bible is the second coming of Jesus, which is the day of judgement. So yeah, the rules won’t change.

Reann wrote:Damn y'all still going at this?

Yes, I take the bible very seriously

Great Altera wrote:Well, it is a book that says slavery is okay, so is having many wives, killing children is a-okay - but only when a non-corporeal voice tells you too, that burning bushes and raining food occurs, that trumpets cause walls to fall down and that carpenter's son came back from the dead.

You could make a religion out of th-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMStODromg8

Doesn’t say slavery, having many wives, and killing kids is okay, it says it HAPPENED. The bible is a HISTORICAL DOCUMENT. And Paul describes how families should be structured and slaves be treated in Thessalonians and Timothy. You may want to look at the difference between what god ENDORSES and what he TOLERATES, they’re too vastly different things, cuz god is patient. And have you heard of this thing called a miracle? Pretty sure a god that made the universe can make a bit of bread appear. Atheism has miracles too. Look up “the big bang” and “life coming from non-life”

Great Altera wrote:Lebanon and Syria used to be great examples of nations with modernised multi-cultural and religious tolerance - and both corrupted by religious extremism exported by Iran.

Wouldn't say that Lebanon was somehow corrupted by Iran, considering the post-independence history of the country and the 1958 crisis, alongside the civil war of course.

Iran has just been able to use the situation there to foster the Hesbollah and its aligned forces.

Holy Karenland wrote:Atheism has miracles too. Look up “the big bang” and “life coming from non-life”

I can't comment on the religious stuff because it's all been said but I wouldn't call The Big Bang and Abiogenesis "miracles". Saying "we don't know yet" is different from "it happened because God". The Big Bang and Abiogenesis actually have pretty solid arguments but at least we can admit it's incomplete and that's fine. Another difference is that we actually can admit we're wrong if there's evidence to prove otherwise and we don't take everything at face-value.

Great Altera wrote:Well that's untrue on all counts. Islam hasn't quite gone through the renaissance and enlightenment that Christianity has (for the most part); and Iran is a bad example - Iran is a country when a ultra-conservative fervent mafia are using religious fervour and twisted doctrine to maintain control over a people; whilst exporting their terror and disfigured ideology to wage a clandestine war against it's enemies.

If the so-called Islamic revolution didn't take place in Iran - it would be a much more enlighten version of Islam we'd be seeing today their (as we began to see in the 60s and 70s) - instead of a nation that is the equivalent to a near ironically-perfect rendition of a Handmaiden's Tale in the Middle East.

Okay then fine, let’s use an example I’m sure many people here support. Send a gay guy to hamas, and I tell you, he’s not going to have a good time.

Nhoor wrote:Me neither to be honest; I mainly use the bible to translate stuff in my conlangs (not for Nhoor yet though, as Nhoor's main religion is not christianity, although I'm sure that IC there have been missionaries who translated at least parts of the bible in Nhoor).

I was raised christian however, went to a christian school and (therefore) had christian friends, but then I moved away, got new friends, and faith was henceforward not included in my life anymore and I never missed it. If I ever had faith; tbh I think I had more of a connection with the people and just played along than for saving my soul or whatever. Being homosexual also complicates matters; the confusing fact that some christians advocate inclusion but other ones brand homosexuality as illegal and want us to burn in hell, some of them even not hesitating to help us on the way, makes me generally feel very uncomfortable around people I don't know who bring up their faith without reason. When someone shouts 'God is good' out of the blue in an otherwise non-religious context, I will try to move away from them as fast as I can.

Actually, they don’t WANT gays to burn in hell, but the bible says that “sodomites (LGBT) will not inherit the kingdom of god (heaven). It’s a warning, not a threat(most of the time). If someone says “all gays are going to hell” they might just be homophobic, since the bible says we can’t judge only god can, but if they say “the bible says being lgbt is a sin” that’s a WARNING to move away from that sin

Takiv wrote:Yeah, the last time I was in a church for a religious service was around a decade ago. I never really understood any of it. Being bi and seeing how some Christians (especially ones in my area) treat LGBT people makes me even less interested

Trust me, anyone who says they’re christian and then goes off yelling “all gays will burn in hell” or participate in violence against lgbt people aren’t actually following the bible. The biblical practice is to warn you that being LGBT is a sin, back it up with a verse (there’s many to choose from for this topic) and where things go from there kinda depends on whether you decide to implement that advice or not. Usually if you don’t, they should probably just politely carry on with their day.

Roendavar wrote:I can't comment on the religious stuff because it's all been said but I wouldn't call The Big Bang and Abiogenesis "miracles". Saying "we don't know yet" is different from "it happened because God". The Big Bang and Abiogenesis actually have pretty solid arguments but at least we can admit it's incomplete and that's fine. Another difference is that we actually can admit we're wrong if there's evidence to prove otherwise and we don't take everything at face-value.

Yeah, but the thing with the Big Bang is it’s the beginning of everything in our universe, including time and space. Anything or anyone outside of that to cause that would have to be powerful enough to create our universe, or by our measures omnipotent, beyond time, since the Big Bang is the start of time, or omniscient, and whatever or whoever made it would also have to be beyond spatial dimensions, since the Big Bang created space, so omnipresent. Wouldn’t something like that fall into the categorisation of a god? Sounds a lot like pretty much every religious idea of god. And we can admit when we’re wrong. We stopped which burnings didn’t we? Because they were biblically wrong. And if I took Leviticus at face value I’d be going around stoning people to death, but I don’t cuz Jesus died on behalf of you, and any Christian worth their merit would agree

Holy Karenland wrote:

Actually, they don’t WANT gays to burn in hell, but the bible says that “sodomites (LGBT) will not inherit the kingdom of god (heaven). It’s a warning, not a threat(most of the time). If someone says “all gays are going to hell” they might just be homophobic, since the bible says we can’t judge only god can, but if they say “the bible says being lgbt is a sin” that’s a WARNING to move away from that sin

Warning - "a statement or event that indicates a possible or impending danger, problem, or other unpleasant situation, or a cautionary advice"

Is that supposed to make me feel good or...? If someone warns me that "I'm not inheriting the Kingdom of God", where does that put me or us? What is outside the Kingdom of God? Are they implying that we suffer or that we just like stand outside heaven and watch for all eternity while you enjoy? Because if that's either of those questions, then I'm pretty sure that can also classify as a threat.

Holy Karenland wrote:Yeah, but the thing with the Big Bang is it’s the beginning of everything in our universe, including time and space. Anything or anyone outside of that to cause that would have to be powerful enough to create our universe, or by our measures omnipotent, beyond time, since the Big Bang is the start of time, or omniscient, and whatever or whoever made it would also have to be beyond spatial dimensions, since the Big Bang created space, so omnipresent. Wouldn’t something like that fall into the categorisation of a god? Sounds a lot like pretty much every religious idea of god. And we can admit when we’re wrong. We stopped which burnings didn’t we? Because they were biblically wrong. And if I took Leviticus at face value I’d be going around stoning people to death, but I don’t cuz Jesus died on behalf of you, and any Christian worth their merit would agree

I'm not mad if that's your view. I just disagree with simplifying a complex question with "it's just not possible". It probably isn't a possibility now because, again, we don't know yet. That's very different from just answering everything with the idea of an omnipotent or omniscient being.

As for the last assertion, I would admit that the Church of today has recognized some of its wrongs and have changed for at least the better. Unfortunately, it still isn't enough for people like me or for others. Whether the argument is to reverse that or to continue a progressive Church is something I won't comment on because I'm not party to the Church.

Roendavar wrote:Warning - "a statement or event that indicates a possible or impending danger, problem, or other unpleasant situation, or a cautionary advice"

Is that supposed to make me feel good or...? If someone warns me that "I'm not inheriting the Kingdom of God", where does that put me or us? What is outside the Kingdom of God? Are they implying that we suffer or that we just like stand outside heaven and watch for all eternity while you enjoy? Because if that's either of those questions, then I'm pretty sure that can also classify as a threat.

Well, god is the embodiment of all good, and heaven is eternal life with god, or the embodiment of good. Hell is separation from god, which means separation from all things good, or, in simple terms, suffering. And no, it’s not meant to feel good. In fact, the bible says that one must “deny himself and take up their cross every day”. It’s tough, but spending eternity with god is worth the loss. And it’s a warning that GOD (not them) will not let you in if you don’t repent for your sodomy (repent means to genuinely apologise and take action to not do that action again). And it’s your choice on whether or not you want to trust that. They won’t harm you.

Roendavar wrote:I'm not mad if that's your view. I just disagree with simplifying a complex question with "it's just not possible". It probably isn't a possibility now because, again, we don't know yet. That's very different from just answering everything with the idea of an omnipotent or omniscient being.

As for the last assertion, I would admit that the Church of today has recognized some of its wrongs and have changed for at least the better. Unfortunately, it still isn't enough for people like me or for others. Whether the argument is to reverse that or to continue a progressive Church is something I won't comment on because I'm not party to the Church.

No, I’m not answering the question with “it’s god, plain and simple”, I’m answering it with “why would something which caused the universe, which would have to be outside the universe, be subject to our universe’s limitations?”

Holy Karenland wrote:Actually, they don’t WANT gays to burn in hell, but the bible says that “sodomites (LGBT) will not inherit the kingdom of god (heaven). It’s a warning, not a threat(most of the time). If someone says “all gays are going to hell” they might just be homophobic, since the bible says we can’t judge only god can, but if they say “the bible says being lgbt is a sin” that’s a WARNING to move away from that sin.

Trust me, anyone who says they’re christian and then goes off yelling “all gays will burn in hell” or participate in violence against lgbt people aren’t actually following the bible. The biblical practice is to warn you that being LGBT is a sin, back it up with a verse (there’s many to choose from for this topic) and where things go from there kinda depends on whether you decide to implement that advice or not. Usually if you don’t, they should probably just politely carry on with their day.

Too many people and institutions, even governments, do want gays to burn in hell and take the bible as their back-up to do awful things in the name of their belief, while other christians look the other way. If these people are not in fact following the bible, please enlighten them, while I personally find it difficult to tell the difference. I'm not sure a LGBTQ+ person who is discriminated, called names, sent to reconversion camps, or beaten up in the streets will take much comfort when they realise that their assailants aren't actually following the bible.

Holy Karenland wrote:Islam has remained exactly the same for 1500 years and you aren’t nearly as against that. Try going to Iran and see how accommodating they will be to your lifestyle.

That's a bit of an odd takeaway, considering I specifically mentioned Iran as being worse

Shidei wrote:Of course we're better off than in places like Iran and Afghanistan

I have many things to say about places like those and suggestions for what should happen to their various flavors of "morality police". Those countries should be taken as a warning for what happens when there isn't analysis and interpretation of religion to fit within the current age (you can even see this in "recent" terms after 1979 when Iran regressed to an oppressive hardline theocracy, or even more recently with the Taliban in Afghanistan treating women arguably worse than anywhere else on the entire planet). But Islam was not relevant to what I was responding to, which was the statement from Wellsia that I read as him saying Christianity was on the decline because it was trying to be too accommodating. You've fallen into the trap of assuming being against one thing means support of another.

I do support religion, despite how it may come off at times. But more importantly than that I support the notion that it is a deeply personal and private thing that should not be weaponized against anyone male, female, believer, nonbeliever, whatever. It's a shame that in many places it's on the decline, but the burden should be placed on and carried out by the faithful to ensure the correct messages are being followed and spread and to be accepting of people who are not interested in following those rules. When you have a very loud minority of people using it to oppress others, it's understandable why people are shying away from it even if the majority of followers do not behave that way

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