Philosophy 115 RMB

WA Delegate (non-executive): The State of Telgan (elected 22 days ago)

Founder: The ✪ Star-Studded Eudaemonium ✪ of Dr George

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We are the #1 region in NationStates for approaching life rationally without unfounded assumptions.
KEYWORDS: Peace,Justice,Democracy,Tolerance,Fellowship and Friendship,Fun,Questioning authority

Region Founded 10 February 2005.
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Featured Region on 21 July 2009.
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Regional Power: High

Philosophy 115 contains 139 nations, the 71st most in the world.


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1.The Enlightened Purgatory of NW Hell Rehab CenterPsychotic Dictatorship“The good intention capital of the world”
2.The ☆Star-Spangled Juggernaut☆ of New Old New New YorkCivil Rights Lovefest“Setting the pace since 5 June 2004.”
3.The Kingdom of NaothielWA MemberCivil Rights Lovefest“Imagination is more important than knowledge.”
4.The Constitutional Monarchy of Kingdom of CambriaWA MemberDemocratic Socialists“Lorem Ipsum allof Brfs Triu Dipof Lort au Brtnki Sonx”
5.The Dionysian Republic of Christminster0WA MemberLeft-wing Utopia“Live Slow Die Whenever”
6.The State of TelganWA MemberLeft-wing Utopia“Work; buy; consume; die.”
7.The Nomocratic Commonwealth of Central KadiganWA MemberLiberal Democratic Socialists“Scientia Vincere Tenebras”
8.The Atheist Empire Ambassador of Superior IntelligenceCorrupt Dictatorship“Eternal Peace, Wealth and Progress by HIS Intelligence!”
9.The Most Serene Republic of XampotismInoffensive Centrist Democracy“Happiness, prosperity, security, equality, justice”
10.The Territories of Schiratian ConfederacyWA MemberCivil Rights Lovefest“To Freedom and Wisdom”
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Regional Poll • What shall we do about the upcoming zombie invasion?

Poll called by The ✪ Star-Studded Eudaemonium ✪ of Dr George

Voting opened 4 days ago and will close in 2 days 3 hours. Open to residents. You cannot vote as you are not logged in.

Last poll: “What Godzilla foe or friend would you rather be?”

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Philosophy 115 Regional Message Board

The ✪ Star-Studded Eudaemonium ✪ of Dr George wrote:If we're going with some form of utilitarianism, maximizing pleasure and minimizing pain, then it seems we are ethically bound to cure the infected: the infected give no appearance of feeling pain, while their victims' screams of agony as they are torn limb from limb and eaten alive suggest great pain indeed.

The whole idea of a 'cure' is grossly discriminatory. Being a zombie is emphatically NOT like having diphtheria or cancer- it's a personal transformation which results in a different way of being and perceiving the world. Zombies don't want to be 'cured' (we'd much rather carry on eating your brains). 'Curing' us all against our will would be an extreme violation of our rights, and would in fact be a form of genocide. Is that really ethical? I don't think so.

Consider the alternative. As you say, zombies don't feel pain. But we are conscious, and we do actively enjoy feasting on the living. If, instead of trying to destroy us, you accepted the many gifts that zombiehood brings, you'd be actually be putting an end to suffering. Of course, there'd be a certain amount of horrific violence as we devoured our screaming victims, but that would be a kind of interim phase. As the saying goes, you can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs.

Weighing up the temporary pain of the victims against the long-term benefits of zombiehood is tricky, but any truly rational analysis of the pros and cons will surely come down on the side of the zombies. So c'mon- make the ethical choice of joining us in destroying humanity.

What do zombies eat after all non-zombie humans (and, most importantly, their BRAAAAAAAAAINS) are devoured? Is all utility transitory, in the end, and would pursuing medium-term utility condemn the fully-zombified hordes to a slow and painful starvation?

Good point. As it happens, we can eat things other than human brains. It's just that the brains are much tastier, and we have an overwhelming lust for eating them. Eating a nice warm human brain is just about the most pleasurable thing imaginable- you really should try it yourself.

In the long term, food supply isn't the problem- the big issue is that we aren't alive, and therefore can't reproduce. The zombie population of the world would therefore gradually decline due to accidents and violence between zombies. Sadly, we would end up being extinct- but it would take a long time.

...And then the world could recover from all of the ecological damage that you living types have inflicted on it. Embracing zombiedom is the ecological choice as well as the ethical one.

pssst: I'm still here.

*Skritches Puppies' ears*

The Borderlands of The Ravening Zombie Hordes wrote:The whole idea of a 'cure' is grossly discriminatory. Being a zombie is emphatically NOT like having diphtheria or cancer- it's a personal transformation which results in a different way of being and perceiving the world. Zombies don't want to be 'cured' (we'd much rather carry on eating your brains). 'Curing' us all against our will would be an extreme violation of our rights, and would in fact be a form of genocide. Is that really ethical? I don't think so.

Hmm... it seems to me that the situation is more akin to the compulsory treatment of those with mental health conditions. The UN has a set of principles governing this:
(The WA does too, but is much less thorough. viewtopic.php?p=5103076#p5103076 )

At the core of it, to treat someone against their will, they must be held involuntarily, lack capacity to consent (or unreasonably withhold consent), and be treated in their best interests regarding their health needs. Alternatively, the treatment must be urgently necessary in order to prevent immediate or imminent harm to the patient or to other persons.

So we can justify zombie treatment on the basis that zombies clearly require treatment to restore their bodies and minds to working order, and they lack the capacity to consent (our friend The Ravening Zombie Hordes presumably being an exception).

Zombies are not mentally impaired- we're just different. All that we want is to be free to slaughter and cannibalize the living. It may seem unreasonable to you, but to us it makes perfect sense.

Instead of trying to pathologize the living dead, why not join us? I can assure you that you won't find any homophobia in our ranks. We'll eat anyone- gay, straight, bi, male or female.

Ah, but my Zombie Horde colleague, if you eat us, are you not forcing the same nonchoice situation upon us? Perhaps I do not wish to become a stumbling, drooling walker, demanding to dine upon friends and family. Should I be forced to join you?

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Welcome to P115, Schopenhauer!
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So which is the better analogy, zombies as the genius of Carnivoria, taking meat-eating to its grisly, logical conclusion? or like the hopelessly schizophrenic, needing to be restrained and cured against their wills?

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